Recently I was reading a polyamory message board I subscribe to and came across a post from a couple just introducing themselves to the group. This couple is looking for a poly relationship but have been discouraged because as they put it: "All that's out there is swingers and polygamists".
Wow. This is a stark reminder of the constant battle and differing views between swingers and polyamorists, both thinking the other is "wrong" or "unethical" or "immoral".
See, many swingers get their panties all in a wad at the mere mention of feelings and intimacy developing between play partners. They recoil like a surprised snake ready to strike back. And often they do. I can't tell you the number of times Mrs. Scribbens and I have been on the other side of a scared swinger loudly proclaiming that if feelings were ever to develop between their spouse and someone esle how it would end right there and yadda, yadda, yadda.
Of course this reaction is based solely in fear and insecurity. It's the fear that if feelings develop they may get left for the other person or not be number one in their partner's life or that their partner may only love them half as much.
On the other side is the polyamorists. Some seem to think they are an evolved species, far above the lowly, morally bankrupt and unethical swinger because they "love" their partners, not just have sex with them. It's an arrogant and self-righteous stance taken by some to justify having sex outside their primary relationship; it's okay because they are "in love" with their third.
Of course this reaction is based on the concept that only sex within a committed relationship is permittable, so they seek and develop several committed relationships to justify having a sexually open relationship. It's also based in their deep-rooted beliefs from their upbringing that what they are doing is not right, so they proclaim their "correctness" loudly and proudly, demoting some in hopes of elevating themselves in the eyes of others and thus justifying their beliefs to themselves.
The fact is that there is quite an overlap between swinging and polyamory. Imagine if you will two circles, overlapping at one side. In one circle you have the pure swingers and in the other you have the pure polyamorists. However in that overlap area are the swingers that are open to polyamory and the polyamorists who are also open to the purely recreational sex that swinging provides.
Mrs. Scribbens and I fall in that overlap.
We see many other couples in this overlap also. Swingers who become "exclusive" with another couple or a single for quite a while (say 3 - 12 months) and polyamorists who practice what I call "serial polyamory" where they are in a committed relationship with another single or couple for a while (say 3 - 12 months) than move-on to another couple or single. The swinger couple won't admit they are practicing polyamory in even it's basic form and the polyamorists won't admit that they are swinging in even the loosest meaning of the word. But the fact is they are both doing the same thing, just calling the same horse by a different name, and in some case throwing rocks at each other for doing it the way they do because it's "wrong", "immoral" or "unethical".
Mrs. Scribbens and I subscribe to the idea that "Whatever gets you through the night's alright." Any form a happy, healthy, loving adult relationship takes is "right" because it's right for the people involved. Nobody has a right to throw rocks at the other proclaiming that their way of living and managing relationships is any more right than someone else's. And the people that do so are just as bad as the "traditional" relationship folks that anger them so for judging their alternative lifestyle.
For us, Gus from My Big Fat Greek Wedding sums it up best: "Here tonight, we have, ah, apple and orange. We all different, but in the end, we all fruit."
Monday, July 21, 2008
Thursday, July 17, 2008
Will and Jada and the swinging controversy
There has been allot of Internet buzz the past few days about Will Smith's comments about his and Jada's marriage agreement. In short everyone is saying they are swingers. Well, I don't think so, and here is why.
They are not really swingers because based on what Will said they have never had sex with someone else while they've been married to each other. They just have an understanding that it is natural human nature to desire other people sexually and that doesn't mean that you love them, it just means that you lust them and want to have sex with them and that Will and Jada are honest with each other about it.
I respect them for it because they are honest with each other, and can be honest with each other while at least half the people that are shocked and horrified by Will's statement are hiding things from their partner, and many of them have, are or will cheat on their partner. Will and Jada have simply made a pact to always be honest with each other and to discuss things like this before they could happen.
That's light years beyond what most couples do. Instead most couples hide their true feelings, dreams and fantasies from each other because knowledge of such may hurt or anger their partner due to their partner's personal insecurities. They have set themselves up from day one to not be honest with each other in an attempt to save each others feelings and avoid conflict.
Here is the copy and paste from the article:
‘Our perspective is, you don’t avoid what’s natural and you’re going to be attracted to people,’ Will explains.
‘So sometimes we have the discussion: “Wow, this or that girl is freaking gorgeous”. I’m not going to say anything to my buddies that’s any different than what I say to my wife.’
And Will, 39, reckons he'll tell Jada - and she'll tell him - if they ever find they can't resist their desire.
'If it came down to it, then one would say to the other: "Look, I need to have sex with somebody. Now I’m not going to do it if you don’t approve of it,"’ he says.
'In our marriage vows, we didn't say "forsaking all others". We said, "You will never hear I did something afterwards". Because if that happens, the relationship is destroyed.'
But Will's not sure what he'd do if one day Jada, 38, confides that she does want to take a lover.
‘I don’t know how I’d feel,’ he confesses. ‘But I know I would react better than if I found out about it afterwards.’
You'll notice that nowhere in there does it say that they have done it, just that they have an understanding that if the opportunity presented itself that they could as long as it's discussed beforehand.
So I say, "Good for you Will and Jada, you're a tighter couple than most could ever wish to be."
They are not really swingers because based on what Will said they have never had sex with someone else while they've been married to each other. They just have an understanding that it is natural human nature to desire other people sexually and that doesn't mean that you love them, it just means that you lust them and want to have sex with them and that Will and Jada are honest with each other about it.
I respect them for it because they are honest with each other, and can be honest with each other while at least half the people that are shocked and horrified by Will's statement are hiding things from their partner, and many of them have, are or will cheat on their partner. Will and Jada have simply made a pact to always be honest with each other and to discuss things like this before they could happen.
That's light years beyond what most couples do. Instead most couples hide their true feelings, dreams and fantasies from each other because knowledge of such may hurt or anger their partner due to their partner's personal insecurities. They have set themselves up from day one to not be honest with each other in an attempt to save each others feelings and avoid conflict.
Here is the copy and paste from the article:
‘Our perspective is, you don’t avoid what’s natural and you’re going to be attracted to people,’ Will explains.
‘So sometimes we have the discussion: “Wow, this or that girl is freaking gorgeous”. I’m not going to say anything to my buddies that’s any different than what I say to my wife.’
And Will, 39, reckons he'll tell Jada - and she'll tell him - if they ever find they can't resist their desire.
'If it came down to it, then one would say to the other: "Look, I need to have sex with somebody. Now I’m not going to do it if you don’t approve of it,"’ he says.
'In our marriage vows, we didn't say "forsaking all others". We said, "You will never hear I did something afterwards". Because if that happens, the relationship is destroyed.'
But Will's not sure what he'd do if one day Jada, 38, confides that she does want to take a lover.
‘I don’t know how I’d feel,’ he confesses. ‘But I know I would react better than if I found out about it afterwards.’
You'll notice that nowhere in there does it say that they have done it, just that they have an understanding that if the opportunity presented itself that they could as long as it's discussed beforehand.
So I say, "Good for you Will and Jada, you're a tighter couple than most could ever wish to be."
Saturday, July 12, 2008
Sunday, July 6, 2008
What is an open relationship?
The first post here. For those that have been in or are currently in an open relationship of any kind, the following information may be old hat. But for those unfamiliar with the different types of open relationships I'll recap the basics here.
An open relationship is any relationship (usually between two partners) where the participants are allowed to have sexual or otherwise intimate relationships with others. Open relationships take on many forms, the most common being:
Open relationship or marriage: This is where one partner or both date others, usually without their primary partner being an integral part of the outside relationship.
Swinging: This is where a married or otherwise committed couple includes other couples and singles in their sex life. This can be through swapping partners in foursomes or moresomes, or just including another single for a threesome. In a swinging relationship sex is usually the focus and intimate, loving relationships are not the norm.
Polyamory: This is where a person carries-on more than one loving, intimate relationship at a time with the full knowledge and consent of everyone involved. Polyamory differs from swinging and "open marriages" in that much of the time all three or four or more people involved are either mutual lovers or at least good friends. Some polyamorous relationships include cohabitation and others don't.
Mrs. Scribbens and I started our open relationship status through swinging, mostly to allow her to experiment with her bi-side. We started by having sex with other couples but along the way included a female or two. Eventually we met a single guy that was just the thing we needed. An emotional relationship developed between Mrs. Scribbens and him, and although at first such a thing was absolutely terrifying to us, when it happened it seemed absolutely natural. In fact, our relationship got better between us because her emotional needs were shared between two men. I no longer had to shoulder everything, and she no longer expected me to.
That was our first excursion into polyamory. There have been many swinging partners in between, and many of them have become very good friends, but we are always open to a polyamorous relationship developing. The idea of each other having someone else in their life that helps complete them is not threatening, but rather exciting and welcome. We love each other greatly, and feel that others only add to that, the idea that Love + Love = More Love. And it does.
An open relationship is any relationship (usually between two partners) where the participants are allowed to have sexual or otherwise intimate relationships with others. Open relationships take on many forms, the most common being:
Open relationship or marriage: This is where one partner or both date others, usually without their primary partner being an integral part of the outside relationship.
Swinging: This is where a married or otherwise committed couple includes other couples and singles in their sex life. This can be through swapping partners in foursomes or moresomes, or just including another single for a threesome. In a swinging relationship sex is usually the focus and intimate, loving relationships are not the norm.
Polyamory: This is where a person carries-on more than one loving, intimate relationship at a time with the full knowledge and consent of everyone involved. Polyamory differs from swinging and "open marriages" in that much of the time all three or four or more people involved are either mutual lovers or at least good friends. Some polyamorous relationships include cohabitation and others don't.
Mrs. Scribbens and I started our open relationship status through swinging, mostly to allow her to experiment with her bi-side. We started by having sex with other couples but along the way included a female or two. Eventually we met a single guy that was just the thing we needed. An emotional relationship developed between Mrs. Scribbens and him, and although at first such a thing was absolutely terrifying to us, when it happened it seemed absolutely natural. In fact, our relationship got better between us because her emotional needs were shared between two men. I no longer had to shoulder everything, and she no longer expected me to.
That was our first excursion into polyamory. There have been many swinging partners in between, and many of them have become very good friends, but we are always open to a polyamorous relationship developing. The idea of each other having someone else in their life that helps complete them is not threatening, but rather exciting and welcome. We love each other greatly, and feel that others only add to that, the idea that Love + Love = More Love. And it does.
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